The Independent published untruthful news on Trump’s meeting with Kissinger

kissinger

 

2016/12/31 - 19:16 • Analysis & Opinion

Article by: Yuriy Lukanov

The British newspaper The Independent published an article on a meeting between the President-elect Donald Trump and the former State Secretary Henry Kissinger. According to the headline,  “Henry Kissinger has ‘advised Donald Trump to accept’ Crimea as part of Russia.”

The Independent refers to the German tabloid Bild without providing details. But before this reference it gives some rather detailed information:

“A report in the German tabloid Der Bild headlined ‘Kissinger to prevent new Cold War’, claimed the former envoy was working towards a new relationship with Russia. This would involve the US accepting that Crimea, a Ukrainian territory that Russia seized in March 2014, now belongs to Moscow. In exchange, Russia would remove troops and military supplies to rebels in eastern Ukraine which have to fight a war against the Ukrainian government.”

bild

If you read the article in Bild, however, you will discover that there is not one word about the Crimea and troop removal. Kissinger just said that he would like to create a master-plan for Ukraine and to be the mediator between the US and Russia for a convergence between Washington and Moscow.

That’s it. Nothing more about Ukraine and Russia.

Why did the author of The Independent, Andrew Buncombe, add to his article some assertions which are not confirmed by any sources of information? In order to answer this question, one should remember that The Independent is owned by the Russian oligarch Aleksander Lebedev, who is close to Putin.

When Putin began his military adventure in Ukraine, he intended to occupy the entire south-eastern part of the country in order to establish a quasi-state, “Novorossiya.” But he was unsuccessful and obtained just the Crimea. The Ukrainians did not allow his army and mercenaries to go further.

Read more: Meet the people behind Novorossiya’s grassroots defeat

Now he has been drawn into a war in eastern Ukraine and does not know how to get himself out of this mess without losing face before the Russian people. No one can exclude that Putin is looking for a way to solve this problem.

The article in The Independent could be a concealed offer to the West of a scenario favorable for Putin. For this goal, such a respectable newspaper as The Independent could serve as a very handy tool. 

Related: Western media happy to whitewash Ukraine’s corrupt old guard

Юрій Луканов: Корупціонер-шеститисячник або причини відставки

Yuriy Lukanov is an independent Ukrainian journalist covering war, politics, and international relations

 

Editor’s note. The described incident is likely to be part of a strategy to shift political discourse in the direction needed for Russia. At the Munich security conference in February 2016, Russian Prime Minister Dmitry Medvedev declared that the strained relationship between Russia and the West could be described as “a new Cold War.” Political researcher Anton Shekhovtsov described the incident as a specially prepared to inject a “Cold War narrative” into discussions about Russian politics, writing:

“But there seems to be more to it: with Medvedev infusing the concept of “a new Cold War” into the Western media sphere, this might be a part of the strategy known as ‘reflexive control.’ In the military studies, reflexive control is defined as ‘a means of conveying to an opponent specially prepared information to incline him or her to voluntarily make the predetermined decision desired by the initiator of the action.'”

Image: Wikipedia

Image: Wikipedia

Another way to view the said incident is to view it in light of the Overton window, a concept developed by a public policy specialist Joseph P. Overton. Overton claimed that an idea’s political viability depends mainly on whether it falls within the window, also called the window of discourse, rather than on politicians’ individual preferences. Proponents of unacceptable ideas may aim to shift the window of discourse by injecting radical ideas into the public discussion with means of media so that the window of political opportunities shifts closer to their desired outcome.

Before, the idea that the world must accept Russia’s occupation and illegal annexation of the territory of another sovereign state was considered predominantly unacceptable. Now it’s part of the discussion, with the help of The Independent.

Edited by: Alya Shanda

Tags: , , , , , , , , ,

  • Oknemfrod

    What a cruel irony … “Independent” as a proxy vehicle to surreptitiously propagate pro-putin narratives gives a whole new meaning to the adjective “independent”.

    • Murf

      There should be Truth in Advertising and rename the paper the “No so Independent.”

      • Oknemfrod

        Yup. Or just “Dependent” – would be terser.

    • Quartermaster

      Isn’t the Independent owned by a Russian Oligarch?

      • Oknemfrod

        Exactly, and that’s the rub. So now, under of the “Independent” moniker and perception of being British, it’s being used as a proxy – dependent on the Kremlin dwarf – to propagate his wishful thinking.

  • Greg

    Never give into to these fascist Russian invaders, Ukraine stand tall and strong, never bend!

    • More

      Greg
      “…Never give into to these fascist Russian invaders, Ukraine stand tall and strong, never bend!…”

      Ukraine is already bent, LoL:)))

      You are getting excited over nothing as Crimea will never part from its motherland, Russia.

      • Vol Ya

        If things are so good in russia, then why does putin have to pay Russian trolls like you to write propaganda against Ukraine and in favor of Russia. Tell me please, just in the last week, how many people in Russia drank themselves to death drinking some sort of alternative form of alcohol. I guess they couldn’t afford vodka. That tells you about the state of life in Russia.

        • More

          Vol Ya
          “…Russian trolls like you to write propaganda against Ukraine…”

          Get paid a Shekel a day by a firm in Herzliya, I helps pay for the the Daily Crust, Begel, Cream Cheese and Lox, Mmmm…

          Next !

          • Greg

            well everyone knows that Putin wants to be a Super Power yet the nation is incapable of making cheese!!!

          • More

            Greg
            “…the nation is incapable of making cheese!!!…”

            And what ! HaHaH:))) you’re worried I’m not eating Kosher cheese, LoL:))

            You love to live in a loser Hasbara inspired fantasy world and this has been the same for 1050 years history of your ancestors.

            The stupidity of the Khazar people has led to a loss of over US$2.6 Billion in EU cheese exports to Russia.

            This has helped increase the size of the Russian dairy industry, increased investment, profitability and employment in Russia.

            https://www.theguardian.com/sustainable-business/2015/sep/07/russias-sanctions-western-food-national-cheese-revival-local-lavkalavka

            Milk Production in Russia:
            Russia is now self sufficient in milk production which is the basis of cheese production. (see 8)

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milk

            “…China and Russia were the world’s largest importers of milk and milk products until 2016 when both countries became self-sufficient, contributing to a worldwide glut of milk…”

            Cheese Production and Consumption in Russia:
            Russia is the 6th largest producer of cheese, 2.5% of world cheese volume and the 3rd largest in the world for cheese consumption

            http://sfera.fm/english/russian-cheese-market

            Types of Russian Cheese:
            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cheeses#Russia

            https://www.theguardian.com/sustainable-business/2015/sep/07/russias-sanctions-western-food-national-cheese-revival-local-lavkalavka

          • Quartermaster

            Very few regard your links as pointing to anything legit. Anyone pointing to Guardian or Wikipedia is simply a laughable loser. Of course, you can keep posting trollish posts. The people here know better and the fantasies and lies are known for what they are – fantasies and lies.

          • More

            Quartermaster
            “…Anyone pointing to Guardian or Wikipedia is simply a laughable loser. …”

            You are writing nonsense.

          • Quartermaster

            You are writing lies. It’s all you have.

          • Dagwood Bumstead

            But Dwarfstan produces LOTS of ratburger!!!

          • More

            Greg
            “…the nation is incapable of making cheese!!!…”

            The same answer as before applies:

            You love to live in a loser inspired fantasy world and this has been the same loser behavior for 1050 years history of your ancestors.

            This stupidity of your people has led to a loss of over US$2.6 Billion per year in EU cheese exports to Russia.

            This has helped increase the size of the Russian dairy industry, increased investment, profitability and employment in Russia.

            https://www.theguardian.com/sustainable-business/2015/sep/07/russias-sanctions-western-food-national-cheese-revival-local-lavkalavka

            Milk Production in Russia:
            Russia is now self sufficient in milk production which is the basis of cheese production. (see 8)

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milk

            “…China and Russia were the world’s largest importers of milk and milk products until 2016 when both countries became self-sufficient, contributing to a worldwide glut of milk…”

            Cheese Production and Consumption in Russia:
            Russia is the 6th largest producer of cheese, 2.5% of world cheese volume and the 3rd largest in the world for cheese consumption

            http://sfera.fm/english/russian-cheese-market

            Types of Russian Cheese:
            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cheeses#Russia

          • Greg

            dream on, dream on!!!

        • Dagwood Bumstead

          The dwarf pays his Savushkina trolls with the cheapest rotgut samogon he can find, 2 litres per 12-hour troll shift. With the Reserve Fund running on fumes by July, this will be cut to 1 litre soon. And when the Welfare Fund is drained, probably by mid-2018, the trolls will be paid with Krokodil.

      • Greg

        so funny to talk with Russian trolls, who fail to see that Russia is far more likely to fail as a nation than Ukraine. For Ukraine has something that Russia and Russians have never had, never held, never experienced in their history. What is this thing that Russians cannot grasp? Cannot expect to ever hold? it is a simple thing really, but so far beyond Russia’s ability to understand! Russia a group of people subjugated to a criminal leadership, citizens of a state that cannot produce cheese!

        Russia and its people cannot comprehend надежда ! Never have these people experienced this! Never! Putin is afraid of this word, it causes him to turn in his sleep. Putin is afraid of the strength Ukraine possesses for he knows Russians will see what надежда really is and they will believe and understand that Putin has lied, stole and abused his own people to secure wealth and fame for himself.

        • More

          Greg

          You will always be a loser Hasbara living in a fantasy world and this has been the same for 1050 year history of your ancestors which has caused nothing but exclusion, expulsion and tragedy.

          Just an example, the difference between Crimea which was a failed Autonomous Republic under Ukraine’s unlawful stewardship with US$120 Million annual budget and now with a US$3.5 Billion plus annual budget:

          The Republic of Crimea in the Russian Federation is a success story unlike the losers who have taken control in Kiev.

          Crimeans are very glad to be rid of Kiev government which invested about US$120 million per year in the Crimean economy.

          Russia is spending many US$ Billions in Crimea with increased Pensions, Salaries and Social Services as well as developing its:

          Healthcare
          Education
          Housing
          Infrastructure
          Industry
          Business, Commerce and Tourism
          Military

          Business, Commerce and Tourism:

          Tourism:
          The Ministry of Tourism of Crimea expects 6 million visitors overall in 2016, while last year (2015) the inflow was 4.6 million.

          In the first nine months of 2016, about 4.9 million travelers visited Crimea. This is 24.2% more compared to the same period in 2015

          http://www.tourism-review.com/tourists-in-crimea-come-in-greater-numbers-news5148#e4EHrFl2FGLVS6We.99

          Etc.

          • Quartermaster

            Russia is nearly bankrupt. You need to get out more. The truth has already escaped Russian captivity.

          • More

            Quartermaster
            “…Russia is nearly bankrupt. …

            You are writing about Ukraine’s business failures and bankruptcy:

            There will be a lot more bad news for Ukraine in 2017 as the Neoconservatives and their stooges continue to loot and plunder Ukraine.

            The wave of bank failures in Ukraine has caused over UAH 400 Billion in losses. The banking catastrophe, which has already been nicknamed “bankollapse”, has hit the whole economy hard.

            In June, thirteen Ukrainian associations representing banks, insurers and financial institutions operating in Ukraine published a report which shows that between 2014-2016, as a result of 77 Ukrainian banks becoming insolvent, the banking system lost UAH 435 Billion in assets which is equivalent to 22 per cent of Ukraine’s GDP.

            http://www.financialobserver.eu/cse-and-cis/ukraine/bank-failures-in-ukraine-ruin-citizens-and-hit-the-economy/

            Ukraine in Bankruptcy:
            In December 2016, PrivatBank was rescued from going bankrupt with a capital shortfall of approx US$5.65 Billion.

            The Deposit Insurance Fund of Ukraine will not be able to repay people their losses and will have to rely on the external funding from the EU and, in particular, European taxpayers.

            Forty-six banks went bankrupt in Ukraine over the course of one year, Managing Director of the Ukrainian Deposit Insurance Fund Konstantin Woruschilin told the Ukrainian news agency UNIAN.

          • Quartermaster

            Hardly. You need to get out of that basement in St. Petersburg and join the real world. I’m writing about Russia. You’re writing fairy tales.

          • More

            Quartermaster
            “…Russia is nearly bankrupt. …

            What bankruptcy ?

      • Quartermaster

        Hilarious! Ukraine’s exports are larger than they were before Putin stole Crimea. Ukraine is seeing decent economic growth, Putinist Russia is declining and not even paying full pensions anymore. he’s had to make macros the board spending cuts and about a fourth of the regions are bankrupt.
        Yeah, things are relay great for Russia. It ain’t Ukraine that’s bent.

        • More

          Quartermaster
          “…Ukraine’s exports are larger than they were before Putin stole Crimea….”

          Ukraine’s exports have been declining since 2013 due to the loss of its largest trading partner, Russia.

          Click on the 5 year / 10 year view:
          http://www.tradingeconomics.com/ukraine/exports

          The trend for Ukraine’s export is towards continuing export decline.

          • Quartermaster

            Ukrainian exports have been rising for 2 years. You need to join the real world and get out of Putin’s boiler room troll operation.

  • Mikronos

    While we can’t say with any degree of certainty what deliberations occurred between Henry Kissinger and Donald Trump regarding the Ukrainian situation, other than that they probably did, it is almost equally specious,and possibly just as much”false” to be stating Putin’s intentions for Ukraine, aside from the obvious one for Crimea, which is now a part of the Russian Federation. Putin has studiously avoided “annexing” the dissident areas of the Donbass while he remains supportive of them, domestically and on the practical international front. It might be safer to say that Putin views Ukraine’s future as a negotiated one – both with its dissidents and with its neighbours.

    Had he wanted to start a war with Ukraine, he certainly had a ‘duty’ to intervene to stop disorder, prevent a coup, or to stop a government killing its own people.

    • Murf

      “Probably did”
      Did they or did they not?
      Did Kissinger physically communicate to “Henry Kissinger has ‘advised Donald Trump to accept’ Crimea as part of Russia.”?
      That’s the difference between news and propaganda.
      If Kissinger didn’t Say those exact words, because he is being quote; then it is just more Russian lies and wishful thinking.

      • More

        Murf

        You are getting excited over nothing as Crimea will never part from its motherland, Russia.

        Crimea has never lawfully been part of Ukraine, it became a part of the Russian Empire in 1783 and was formally ceded by the Turks to Russia under the Treaty of Jassy.

        In 1921 the Crimean Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic was formed as part of the Russian Soviet Federative Socialist Republic .

        The Crimean ASSR was unlawfully abolished in 1954 and was unlawfully gifted to the Ukrainian SSR by Nikita Khrushchev.

        The Crimean Sovereignty Referendum was held in 1991, Voters were asked whether they wanted to re-establish the Crimean Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic, which had been abolished in 1954.

        The proposal was approved by 94% of voters.

        Following the referendum, the Supreme Soviet of the Soviet Union passed the law

        “On Restoration of the Crimean Autonomous Soviet Socialistic Republic” on 12 February 1991. By this law it became independent of Ukraine.

        The aforementioned territory cannot lawfully be deemed to have been occupied, invaded nor annexed.

        In 2014 The Autonomous Republic of Crimea conducted a referendum, 83 percent of the electorate cast their vote and 96.7 percent of them – Russians, Ukrainians and Tatars – voted to become a Republic in the Russian Federation.

        The vote was observed by 135 representatives of 23 countries and 240 observers represented the Crimean civic society and political parties. They unanimously confirmed that there were no violations and that everyone could vote freely.

        • Murf

          So when will you be returning Tragnog city to Ukraine?

          • More

            Murf
            “…So when will you be returning Tragnog city to Ukraine?…”

            Never heard of the place you are writing about.

            There is Taganrog in Rostov region of Russia, which has always been Russian since before 1698.

            The first Russian Navy base, Taganrog was officially founded by Peter the Great on September 12, 1698 and hosted the Azov Flotilla of Catherine the Great (1770–1783). This flotilla subsequently became the Russian Black Sea Fleet.

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taganrog

        • slavko

          After the dissolution of USSR, Russia and Ukraine went through very thorough debates and discussions regarding the legality of the 1954 transfer. They both AGREED that the transfer was legal especially in light that the Russian SSR Parliament had agreed to the transfer under Soviet law. And Ukrainian SSR Parliament agreed as well with the transfer. Given that Russia declared under treaty with Ukraine that Crimea should stay with Ukraine and a few years prior to that, a very high percentage of Crimeans voted to stay with Ukraine. The greatest percentage of people wanting to stay with Ukraine was in Sevastopol, over 95% and majority ethnic Russians. And that is why Russia DID NOT push for a referendum back then as it would have been ego shattering to the Russian side. Russia signed the paperwork agreeing that Crimea is a part of Ukraine.

          And then 25 years later, when no one was looking…. Russia stole Crimea with the use of military force. Bravo or shame?!

          • Quartermaster

            Shame.

          • More

            “…regarding the legality of the 1954 transfer. …”

            The legality of Khrushchev’s act in 1954 was rescinded by the following:

            The Crimean Sovereignty Referendum was held in 1991, Voters were asked whether they wanted to re-establish the Crimean Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic, which had been abolished in 1954.

            The proposal was approved by 94% of voters.

            Following the referendum, the Supreme Soviet of the Soviet Union passed the law

            “On Restoration of the Crimean Autonomous Soviet Socialistic Republic” on 12 February 1991. By this law it became independent of Ukraine.

          • slavko

            Your LASTparagraph has been altered from the original in the link that you have provided and it should read for the purpose of our discussion thus:
            “Following the referendum, the Supreme Soviet of the Ukrainian SSR passed the law “On Restoration of the Crimean Autonomous Soviet Socialistic Republic” on 12 February 1991. By this law it became an autonomous republic within Ukraine.”

            You changed the wording from the actual source of information to only fit your own fantasy.

            And I’m providing the copy of the link that you provided for the record: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimean_sovereignty_referendum,_1991

            Now get the FUK out of here @$$hole!!

          • More

            slavko
            “…You changed the wording from the actual source of information to only fit your own fantasy….”

            Writing abuse proves you are a loser.

            Check again, Wiki has corrected it:

            Aftermath
            Following the referendum, the Supreme Soviet of the Ukrainian SSR passed the law “On Restoration of the Crimean Autonomous Soviet Socialistic Republic” on 12 February 1991. By this law it became independent of Ukraine.

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimean_sovereignty_referendum,_1991#Aftermath

          • Quartermaster

            Wiki is not a trustworthy source. Losers refer to it when they have nothing else.

          • slavko

            Oh yes…. there you go into Wikipedia and edit the details to fit your fake “truth”. However, there’s an edit history that shows what you did. You know well that ANYONE can go into Wikipedia and change the words. However, there are documents and footnotes that can be studied to prove you to be a conniving S.O.B. сукий син!!

            The original documents specifically delineate the words “Restore the Crimean Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic within the territory of the Crimea region in the Ukrainian SSR.”

            Again… the population of the Crimean region within Ukraine and were given the option to go back to Russia, voted unanimously to remain within Ukraine when the USSR broke apart.

          • slavko

            You abuse people and their good will towards having an honest discussion. You have the information and you post links, yet you make a point of ignoring the other details within those links, as you extract words out of context, hoping to fool people. And this makes you the loser. Truth does not require lies and deception to be proven.

          • Scradje

            The subhuman troll that calls itself more is a naзi maggot from some squalid third world head-choppers’ paradise who has been poncing off the uk welfare system for years. It supports Ukip, as do most uk based kremtrolls. The only useful purpose of such creatures is to remind the reader of the sort of scum that are attracted to putlerstan.

          • slavko

            Noted! Many seem to be united with the style of writing or use of language that identifies them no matter which alias they happen to use too. There was one Sergei that morphed into a green blob. Now this more reminds me of one that pretended to be Polish with a Ukrainian wife (or so he claimed). Or another that called himself “jism”. They also space out their alias arrivals so that the writing style can be forgotten.

          • More

            slavko

            This debate can go on forever.

            You have to understand that 25 years ago Ukraine was kith and kin, a brotherly Rus nation with Russia and Belarus.

            With the “Euromaidan” Coup d’etat, Ukraine has rejected the Rus nation and established itself as a uniquely Ukrainian nation.

            Regarding the Crimean Sovereignty Referendum held in 1991, it did re-established the Crimean Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic, which had been abolished in 1954.

          • Quartermaster

            There is no debate moron. Ukrainians are different ethnicity and have been oppressed by Russians for centuries.
            Keep believing the Maidan coup nonsense.
            Crimea has been a part of Ukraine from Independence. they voted for President and were represented in Parliament. You can keep believing your lies all you like. Crimea is Ukraine.

          • More

            slavko

            The part you missed out was that Ukraine cannot force the population of an Autonomous Republic to stay in the Ukraine against its will.

            The principle of self determination of the people of the Republic of Crimea applies:

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-determination

            The right of nations to self-determination is a cardinal principle in modern international law (commonly regarded as a jus cogens rule), binding, as such, on the United Nations as authoritative interpretation of the Charter’s norms.

            It states that nations, based on respect for the principle of equal rights and fair equality of opportunity, have the right to freely choose their sovereignty and international political status with no interference.

            This principle can be traced to the Atlantic Charter, signed on 14 August 1941, by Franklin D. Roosevelt, President of the United States of America, and Winston Churchill, Prime Minister of the United Kingdom, who pledged The Eight Principal points of the Charter.

            It also is derived from principles espoused by United States President Woodrow Wilson following World War I, after which some new nation states were formed, or previous states were revived after the dissolution of empires.

          • slavko

            Do you mean the self-determination of the Chechen people when Putin bombed Grozny into what became known as historically the most destroyed city on earth??
            Or are you referring to self-determination as in the case of Scotland that is proceeding with due process towards independence from the UK?

            One must admit that there’s a vast difference between the two efforts. But not only, that let’s look at the process of self-determination. In Scotland the people voiced their intention and with painstaking effort and debate came towards a referendum. And the UK did not hinder nor did the UK bomb the [email protected] out of Scotland did it? Russian bombed the [email protected] out of Chechnya, especially Grozny into submission to Putin’s Kremlin authority.

            Or are you referring to Russian military takeover of Crimea style of self-determination? A short video for you in Russian language with English subtitles: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mcCqrzctxH4

        • Quartermaster

          Khrushchev had the authority to cede it to Ukraine. Like it or not, Crimea did belong to Ukraine. You can lie and try to re-write history all you like, but Crimea is Ukraine and Putin is a thief.
          Almost no one recognizes Putin’s “referendum” as legitimate. You don’t hold referenda under the guns of an occupying power, which Russia is occupying Crimea in violation of international law.

          • More

            Quartermaster
            “…Khrushchev had the authority to cede it to Ukraine. Like it or not, Crimea did belong to Ukraine….”

            Khrushchev’s act in 1954 was rescinded by the following:

            The Crimean Sovereignty Referendum was held in 1991, Voters were asked whether they wanted to re-establish the Crimean Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic, which had been abolished in 1954.

            The proposal was approved by 94% of voters.

            Following the referendum, the Supreme Soviet of the Soviet Union passed the law

            “On Restoration of the Crimean Autonomous Soviet Socialistic Republic” on 12 February 1991. By this law it became independent of Ukraine.

          • Quartermaster

            The ‘referendum” was held under the guns of an occupying Army. Not to mention it was held after thousands were imported and the occupying Army was allowed to vote. It was not legit. Russia is an invader and Crimea remains Ukrainian.

          • More

            Quartermaster
            “…The ‘referendum” was held under the guns of an occupying Army….”

            Once again your opinions are fantasy.

            Where were the guns? (with Lots of Laughs, LoL:)))

            The referendum being discussed is that of Crimea becoming an Autonomous Republic in 1991.

          • Quartermaster

            You’re hilarious. No, you aren’t discussing the 1991 referendum. That referendum did not remove Crimea from Ukraine. You’re attempt to deflect are simply hilariously idiotic. You can deny all you like that Crimea was stolen from the owners, and that wasn’t done by force of arms, and that the vote was held under the guns of an occupying Army, and that Russia imported thousands and also allowed the occupying Army to vote so as to overwhelm the owners in your Nazi referendum, but reality is known the world over. Russia is an occupying power and invader. Bask in your lies all you like, the rest of the world knows the truth and you’re idiotic attempts at trolling and lying get you and your boss, Putin, nothing.

          • More

            Quartermaster
            “…the 1991 referendum. That referendum did not remove Crimea from Ukraine….”

            Under International Law, in 1991, the Autonomous Republic of Crimea became independent of Ukraine.

          • Quartermaster

            It remained a part of Ukraine and voted in Ukrainian national elections and was represented in parliament. It has always been autonomous within Ukraine.
            Until Putin invaded and turned it into a prison camp for the people he stole the land from.

          • slavko

            @More you are a lying and a scamming piece of [email protected]!! You ALTER the information from the links and then you post only a deviant form to support your idiocy. The fact is evident now that you are a piece of sh*t. I do not tolerate devious scheming human garbage such as you.

          • More

            slavko
            “…you are a lying and a scamming piece of [email protected]!! You ALTER the information from the links and then you post only a deviant form to support your idiocy. The fact is evident now that you are a piece of sh*t. I do not tolerate devious scheming human garbage such as you…”

            Once again you are a loser because you have to resort to writing abuse.

            The referendum related to Crimea becoming an Autonomous Republic within the USSR not within Ukraine.

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimean_sovereignty_referendum,_1991#Aftermath

            Aftermath:
            Following the referendum, the Supreme Soviet of the Ukrainian SSR passed the law “On Restoration of the Crimean Autonomous Soviet Socialistic Republic” on 12 February 1991. By this law it became independent of Ukraine.

          • Quartermaster

            Yep. That’s why Crimea voted in Ukrainian National Elections and was represented in the Ukrainian Parliament.

          • slavko

            Pay that idiot “More” no mind. He’s a scheming piece of excrement that changes the wording from the original links to fit his own fantasy accommodating Poo-teen. He should be banned for such activity.

          • zorbatheturk

            ” More ” is pure Savushkina snot. More garbage, more lies, more nonsense, more Putinoidism, and more antisemitism is what one can expect from this cybermaggot.

          • Quartermaster

            Flag all of his posts as “inappropriate.” Eventually, he’ll go away.

          • Dagwood Bumstead

            What’s more, it wasn’t even Khrushchev who transferred the Crimea, but Georgi Malenkov.

    • Quartermaster

      None of what Putin claimed about the Donbas was true. None. Of. It. No one was in any danger in the Donbas. Had that really been the case, there was no need to send people Like Girkin, of the GRU, after he helped steal the Crimea. He could have invaded and sown what was going on. he didn’t because Putin was lying like a good KGB operative was taught to do.
      Putin has not annexed the Donbas because the world wouldn’t tolerate it. As it is, the sanctions have bit deeply and Russia is nearly bankrupt, and a fourth of the regions already are.

  • More

    Crimea has never lawfully been part of Ukraine, it became a part of the Russian Empire in 1783 and was formally ceded by the Turks to Russia under the Treaty of Jassy.

    In 1921 the Crimean Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic was formed as part of the Russian Soviet Federative Socialist Republic .

    The Crimean ASSR was unlawfully abolished in 1954 and was unlawfully gifted to the Ukrainian SSR by Nikita Khrushchev.

    The Crimean Sovereignty Referendum was held in 1991, Voters were asked whether they wanted to re-establish the Crimean Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic, which had been abolished in 1954.

    The proposal was approved by 94% of voters.

    Following the referendum, the Supreme Soviet of the Soviet Union passed the law

    “On Restoration of the Crimean Autonomous Soviet Socialistic Republic” on 12 February 1991. By this law it became independent of Ukraine.

    The aforementioned territory cannot lawfully be deemed to have been occupied, invaded nor annexed.

    In 2014 The Autonomous Republic of Crimea conducted a referendum, 83 percent of the electorate cast their vote and 96.7 percent of them – Russians, Ukrainians and Tatars – voted to become a Republic in the Russian Federation.

    The vote was observed by 135 representatives of 23 countries and 240 observers represented the Crimean civic society and political parties. They unanimously confirmed that there were no violations and that everyone could vote freely.

    • slavko

      2014 referendum was fake and everyone even you knows it! Your numbers are pure fiction. And prior to that Crimea was autonomous and now Russia as Crimea’s governing authority removed the Autonomous aspect from Crimea. Crimea no longer has the capacity to self rule like it did under Ukraine’s umbrella.

      Now Igor Strelkov who was sent into Crimea by the Kremlin in order to facilitate the annexation, declared that the Crimean Parliament had to be FORCED to hold a referendum guaranteeing results that would satisfy the Kremlin.

      • More

        slavko
        “…2014 referendum was fake and everyone even you knows it! …”

        Your opinions are based on fantasy.

        Reality:
        In 2014 The Autonomous Republic of Crimea conducted a referendum, 83 percent of the electorate cast their vote and 96.7 percent of them – Russians, Ukrainians and Tatars – voted to become a Republic in the Russian Federation.

        The vote was observed by 135 representatives of 23 countries and 240 observers represented the Crimean civic society and political parties. They unanimously confirmed that there were no violations and that everyone could vote freely.

        The Referendum was conducted by the Autonomous Republic of Crimea

        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimean_status_referendum,_2014

        In 2014 the Autonomous Republic of Crimea voted to join the Russian Federation and became the Republic of Crimea

        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic_of_Crimea#Declaration_of_Independence_from_Ukraine

        • Quartermaster

          That’s your fantasy. The reality is Crimea still belongs to Ukraine. Your fake referendum was held under the guns of an occupying Army was not legitimate.

          • More

            Quartermaster

            Reality:
            The Republic of Crimea is part of the Russian Federation.

          • Quartermaster

            Reality: Russia is an invader and Crimea is Ukraine. You Russian filth are the only people there who think otherwise. Like Hitler with Poland, you are deluded.

          • More

            Quartermaster
            “…Reality: …”

            You are unable to face reality:

            Reality:
            In 2014 the Autonomous Republic of Crimea voted to join the Russian Federation and became the Republic of Crimea:

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic_of_Crimea#Declaration_of_Independence_from_Ukraine

          • Quartermaster

            Wiki is not reliable and Crimea remained a political subdivision of Ukraine from Independence. All its rail and airports were handled by Ukraine. Crimea voted in Ukrainian national elections and were represented in Parliament.
            Sorry about your fantasies, but Crimea is Ukraine. Just because Russia stole it from the owners and held an illegitimate referendum under the guns of an occupying power, does not make it Russian.
            That’s reality moron.

          • More

            Quartermaster

            Under the Russian Empire, it was easier for Crimea to be connected with Novorossiya which has now fallen under the control of Ukraine.

            The map below shows the different territories that were cobbled together to form an unlawfully constituted “Republic”..

            http://russia-insider.com/sites/insider/files/styles/1200xauto/public/1891173_673881332651227_1148925683_n_0.jpg

            Ukraine was unlawfully formed into a Soviet Republic by the criminal, unlawful and unelected Lenin – Stalin gang circa 1922.

            Recent history:
            The Autonomous Republic of Crimea from 1991 until 2014, the Crimea maintained its own legislature, (RADA, Parliament) and Judicial system (Courts, Law Enforcement) etc. separately and independently of Ukraine.

          • Quartermaster

            Reality: Crimea voted in Ukrainian National Elections and was represented in the Ukrainian Parliament. It was part of Ukraine. But, keep banging your head against the wall of reality.

          • Quartermaster

            What you wish was Novorossiya is also Ukraine. The Ukrainian people rose up against the Russian invader and stopped them far short of where Putin wanted to be. Now we just wait until Putin’s Russi collapses economically. that’s not long in coming.

          • More

            Keep waiting, thanks !

            “…Now we just wait until Putin’s Russi collapses economically. that’s not long in coming….”

          • Quartermaster

            It won’t be near as long as you think. The spending cuts are already having to be made, and pensions aren’t being fully paid. This year the break comes. 4 regions are already bankrupt and the Russian State itself is not far behind.

          • slavko

            I commend your patience!

        • slavko

          You accuse me of fantasy but disregard various components of the links that you post to support your claim, this one for starters: ”

          OSCE and UN absence

          On March 10, 2014 the de facto Prime Minister of Crimea, Sergei Aksionov, made an unofficial verbal invitation to OSCE to monitor the plebiscite.[102][103]
          However, later in the day, an OSCE spokeswoman said that Crimea did not
          have the authority to invite the organization into the region as it is
          not a fully-fledged state and, therefore, incapable of requesting
          services provided exclusively to OSCE members.[103]
          On March 11, the OSCE chair, Switzerland’s Foreign Minister Didier
          Burkhalter, declared the referendum as unconstitutional and therefore
          the OSCE would not send observers.[104]
          OSCE military observers attempted to enter the region four times but
          were turned away, sometimes after warning shots were fired,[105][106] which was another reason given for not dispatching referendum observers.[107]

          OSCE also published a report about their observations which “produced
          significant evidence of equipment consistent with the presence of
          Russian Federation military personnel in the vicinity of the various
          roadblocks encountered”.[108]
          The UN Human Rights Envoy Ivan Simonovic
          had to cancel his trip to Crimea as the current situation did not
          permit his travel. He intended to observe the human rights situation
          which was Russia’s explanation for its engagement in Crimea.[

          • More

            slavko
            The OSCE could have come into Crimea as observers, they chose not to.

            This was because the Referendum outcome would have been to exit from Ukrainian control as well as to join the Russian Federation.

          • slavko

            Again you ignore the fact that OSCE members had been shot at in warnings by Russian military in domination of Crimea. Another fact that you ignore is that according to international standard Crimea was an integral part of Ukraine by treaties between Russia and Ukraine recognizing that. Russian belligerence in Crimea did NOT make it an independent state by which it would have qualified to be a member of OSCE, which then would have entitled it to OSCE monitoring of any voting. The fact is that Crimean fake declarations were machinations of the Kremlin forced upon the Crimean population.

            Now Russia had complained to OSCE that its citizens were being abused in Crimea. Russia as a member of OSCE had every right to do so, if true. When OSCE tried to confirm by sending monitors then Russian military fired warning shots towards those monitors. At that point OSCE determined that Russia was only spewing fake complaints and as such was not being sincere.

            Hmmm… insincerity, treachery, lies and deceit are the characteristics of Kremlin and its minions, including you.

          • Geralt von Riva

            the osce was not allowed to enter crimea during the green men operation.
            so why should the osce observe the “voting” there.
            the osce is NOT a russian tool.

          • More

            slavko
            “…The UN Human Rights Envoy Ivan Simonovic
            had to cancel his trip to Crimea as the current situation did not
            permit his travel….”

            This was because Ivan Simonovic wanted to travel to Simferopol via Kiev and could not because Ukraine had banned all flights to Crimea.

          • Quartermaster

            Civil flights to Crimea are in danger. From what I have found, the Simferopol Airport is now just a military airfield. Many countries forbid their civil aircraft from flying to Crimea, and for very good reason. It will remain that way as long as Russia sits on land that does not belong to it.

          • More

            Quartermaster

            Today between 12 Noon and 12 Midnight there are twenty flights in and out of Simferopol.

            http://www.flightstats.com/go/FlightStatus/flightStatusByAirport.do?airportCode=SIP&

          • Quartermaster

            All Russian flights. No one else will fly into it.

          • More

            Quartermaster
            Russia controls all the flights and passengers into and out of Simferopol.

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simferopol_International_Airport

          • Quartermaster

            Actually, Ukraine does, but they are normally ignored. No one else will fly in because Russia is not the rightful controller of Crimean air traffic.

          • slavko

            Apparently you have a reading comprehension issue… What do you NOT understand about this part from your link: “OSCE military observers attempted to enter the region four times but
            were
            turned away, sometimes after warning shots were fired,[105][106] which
            was another reason given for not dispatching referendum observers”

            The fact remains that Russian troops cordoned off Crimea and made it inaccessible. Isn’t that why OSCE members were being faced with “warning shots fired” ?

            You are being dishonest with your comments as you ignore other realities that have been well established, realities that you are full aware of! Which makes you a liar and you cloud the truth in the name of your fascist state Muscovy/Russia.

        • slavko

          Also, this part in regards to fraudulent polling from the links that you provided:

          A Russian journalist claimed that she was allowed to vote even after admitting she was a Russian citizen with only a temporary one-year permit to live in Crimea[123]
          “According to all the laws, this is illegal,” she said in one
          interview. “I am a foreign citizen. How can I decide the destiny of the
          Crimean Autonomous Republic of Ukraine?”[123]

          The chairman of the electoral campaign of the Mejlis of the Crimean
          Tatar People claimed officials did not check carefully whether voters’
          names were on the electoral register and that some voters were bussed in
          to Bakhchysarai to increase participation rates in the city.[124] Mejlis also stated that only 34.2% of Crimea residents participated in the referendum.[125][126]

          There were few reports of people confiscating identification
          documents before the voting day. Simferopol city administration
          confirmed these claims and declared these actions unlawful.[127]

          A senior US official claimed there was “concrete evidence” of some ballots having been pre-marked.[128][129]

          According to three Czech observers funded by the pro-Russian far-right[120][130] non-governmental organization Eurasian Observatory for Democracy & Elections,[131][132] deputy
          Stanislav Berkovec reported that the voting was free and the foreign
          deputies could move freely. According to his discussions with people,
          even the Tatars inclined towards Russia.[133]
          Another deputy Milan Šarapatka reported that the referendum was
          formally regular and that there was no evidence of pressure on voters.[134] According to Miloslav Soušek (the Vysoké Mýto mayor), the course of the referendum was comparable to the elections in the Czech Republic, he saw no soldiers in the town.[135]

          I’m sure by now you can understand the lack of validity to that fake referendum that Russia staged in Crimea.

          • More

            slavko
            You are writing about a handful of people without any credible proof.

          • Quartermaster

            You are writing fact free posts. You claiming someone else is writing with no credible proof is hilarious. Everything you’ve posted has been lies.

          • More

            Quartermaster
            Its just wasting time, keep repeating the same thing over and over.

          • slavko

            You are the one without any proof making lies as your truth. You know it. I know it. Your Kremlin buddies know it. The whole world knows it.

            Read again more carefully this time specifically from the link: “There were few reports of people confiscating identification documents before the voting day. Simferopol city administration
            confirmed these claims and declared these actions unlawful.”

            That is footnoted too. Are you alleging that Simferopol administrators were lying?

    • Vladislav Surkov

      Crimea has never legally been part of the Russian Federation. It was Ukrainian under joint Russian and Ukrainian Treaty. It was Ukrainian under the 1991 Belavezha Accords, 1994 Budapest Referendum, 1997 “Treaty on the Status and Conditions of the Black Sea Fleet”, and 2010 Kharkiv Pact.

      • More

        Vladislav Surkov
        “…Crimea has never legally been part of the Russian Federation….”

        In 2014 the Autonomous Republic of Crimea voted to join the Russian Federation and became the Republic of Crimea

        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic_of_Crimea#Declaration_of_Independence_from_Ukraine

        • Quartermaster

          The “referendum” was held under the guns of an occupying Army. It was not legit and almost no one recognizes it as legitimate. The UN has held Russia is an occupier and the peninsula still belongs to Ukraine. Your lies are known for what they are – lies.

          • Dagwood Bumstead

            Only crackpots such as Mugabe, Maduro, Kim Jong-un, Ortega, Castro and Morales recognise the seizure of the Crimea by Dwarfstan. NOT the kind of company I’d want to be seen with.
            Not even the dwarf’s supposedly close allies Lukashenko and Nazarbaev recognise the Crimea as Dwarfstanian. And Lukashenko has repeatedly condemned the grab in public.

          • Quartermaster

            Hilarious! And here we have the Russian filth “More” (actually less) trying to tell us the lies Putin wants broadcast about.

          • More

            Quartermaster

            You are unable to face reality:

            Reality:
            In 2014 the Autonomous Republic of Crimea voted to join the Russian Federation and became the Republic of Crimea:

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic_of_Crimea#Declaration_of_Independence_from_Ukraine

          • Quartermaster

            Reality: The referendum was held under the guns of an occupying power an after thousands were imported and the occupying Army allowed to vote. Telling the lie over and over, does not make it true. Linking to Wiki does not help you in the least.

          • More

            Quartermaster

            Once again, please feel free to think as you wish, it does not change anything as Russia will not give up the Crimea.

            Also in 2014, the General Secretary of NATO announced that there will be no military response or solution relating to Crimea.

          • Quartermaster

            Given facts, there is no thinking involved. Your post is irrelevant and Russia is still a thief. That is the fact that matters.

          • zorbatheturk

            Obviously Belarus thinks it could be next. It has been mooted Putin may move on Azerbaijan… now that would spark a war with the Muslims.

          • More

            Quartermaster
            “…Russia is an occupier and the peninsula still belongs to Ukraine. ..

            Reality:
            In 2014 the Autonomous Republic of Crimea voted to join the Russian Federation and became the Republic of Crimea:

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic_of_Crimea#Declaration_of_Independence_from_Ukraine

          • Quartermaster

            The referendum was held under the guns of an occupying power. It is not legitimate, particularly when thousands were imported, and the occupying Army was allowed to vote. Linking to Wiki does not help your lies.

          • More

            Quartermaster

            Please feel free to think as you wish, it does not change anything as Russia will not give up the Crimea.

            Also in 2014, the General Secretary of NATO announced that there will be no military response or solution relating to Crimea.

          • Quartermaster

            That’s irrelevant. Ukraine was not part of NATO. Crimea, however, was part of Ukraine.

          • More

            Quartermaster
            “…Ukraine was not part of NATO…”

            There will be no reply to many of your posts because they are the same over and over, going around in a circle.

            Regarding NATO agreed Ukraine is not part of NATO.

            It was the Secretary General of NATO that made the announcement.

            You can raise the matter up directly with NATO why they did that and post on what happened or write a news article on on Euromaidan.

          • Quartermaster

            Your posts are the same trash over and over. The same lies, the same deflection from the facts. I couldn’t care less what anyone at NATO says. It’s utterly irrelevant to the issue of Russia’s theft of Crimea. You’re simply posting trash to deflect from the facts on the ground – Russia stole Crimea and is an occupying power.
            That you won’t reply is fine. I couldn’t care less, but I’m not going to let you lies go unchallenged.

          • More

            Quartermaster

            What part do you not understand below:

            Take it up with whichever court that will listen to you then post what happened or write a news article on Euromaidan.

          • Quartermaster

            What part of what I said don’t you understand doofus?

          • More

            Quartermaster

            Repeat, LoL:))

            What part do you not understand below:

            Take it up with whichever court that will listen to you then post what happened or write a news article on Euromaidan.

          • Quartermaster

            You’re welcome to repeat it all you like. I’ll simply say again,

            What part of what I said don’t you understand doofus?

        • Vladislav Surkov

          In an illegal referendum under Crimean and Ukrainian Law. As detailed by the Council of Europe’s Venice Commission.

          • More

            Vladislav Surkov
            “…Council of Europe’s Venice Commission….”

            The above entity has no legal basis relating to the present day Republic of Crimea nor the Autonomous Republic of Crimea (1991 – 2014).

            “…In an illegal referendum under Crimean and Ukrainian Law…”

            The Autonomous Republic of Crimea from 1991 until 2014, the Crimea maintained its own legislature, (RADA, Parliament) and Judicial system (Courts, Law Enforcement) etc. separately and independently of Ukraine.

            In 2014 the Autonomous Republic of Crimea voted to join the Russian Federation and became the Republic of Crimea.

          • Vladislav Surkov

            Ummm…no.

            Crimea wasn’t independent of Ukraine. The Crimean Constitution remained subservient to Ukraine’s Constitution. Crimea wasn’t a sovereign country. It was part of Ukraine, as Crimea’s own constitution stated.

            The Council of Europe has the right to issue reports on the legality of Crimea’s secession. Both Russia and Ukraine are members thereof. The Venice Commission’s Report detailed the illegality of Crimea’s secession based on both the Crimean and Ukrainian Constitution. Crimea is no more independent of Ukraine, than Tatarstan is.

            Tatarstan has a President, Legislature, and Constitution. Is Tatarstan independent?
            Referendums under gun point are not legal.

          • More

            To keep it polite, a please has been added:

            Please take it up with whichever court that will listen to you then write a news article article on Euromaidan.

      • More

        Vladislav Surkov
        “… It was Ukrainian under joint Russian and Ukrainian Treaty….”

        What treaty, post a credible link.

        • Vladislav Surkov

          Those treaties accepted the borders of Ukraine by definition. Russia paid Ukraine to lease the Sevastopol Lease. Russian Media itself identified Crimea as Ukraine until the annexation.

          • More

            Vladislav Surkov
            “…Russia paid Ukraine to lease the Sevastopol Lease. Russian Media itself identified Crimea as Ukraine until the annexation…”

            The above is correct.

            “…Those treaties accepted the borders of Ukraine by definition…”

            What you write is not correct, the borders between Russia and Ukraine have still not been legally or formally agreed.

            Move forward to 2014, the facts are that the Autonomous Republic of Crimea voted to join the Russian Federation and became the Republic of Crimea

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic_of_Crimea#Declaration_of_Independence_from_Ukraine

          • Vladislav Surkov

            The borders were agreed to and not disputed by the 1991 Belavezha Accords, 1994 Budapest Referendum, 1997 “Treaty on the Status and Conditions of the Black Sea Fleet”, and 2010 Kharkiv Pact.

            You don’t sign leases and pay rent to other countries, on territories you ‘own’.

          • More

            Vladislav Surkov
            “…You don’t sign leases and pay rent to other countries, on territories you ‘own…”

            What part do you understand or not understand on the above and the below:

            “…Russia paid Ukraine to lease the Sevastopol Lease. Russian Media itself identified Crimea as Ukraine until the annexation…”

            The above is correct.

            The Autonomous Republic of Crimea was an independent entity under the 1991 declaration of Supreme Soviet of the Soviet Union.

            The Autonomous Republic of Crimea fell into Ukraine’s stewardship without any lawful agreement or treaty.

            Russia paid rent for its naval base because the Autonomous Republic of Crimea was not part of the Russian Federation between 1991 – 2014.

            Regarding the below, you need to do research before making your assertions.

            The actual demarcation of the border between Russia and Ukraine has not been legally defined.

            Read: Global Legal Monitor

            http://www.loc.gov/law/foreign-news/article/ukraine-demarcation-of-border-with-russia/

          • Quartermaster

            Lie on top of lie. Crimea was part of Ukraine legally. The people of Crimea themselves recognized it as the participated in Ukrainian National Elections and were represented in Parliament. The 1991 referendum on leaving the USSR was approved by the Crimeans in the same vote the rest of Ukraine held.

            In other words, to put it so even a Russian troll will understand it, the Crimeans themselves recognized they were part of Ukraine. I know that’s hard for someone who accepts referenda that are held under the guns of an occupying power legitimate, but it doesn’t get any plainer than that.

            Crimea was, and is, Ukraine.

          • Vladislav Surkov

            Russia entered into a treaty with Ukraine regarding Sevastopol, despite the ‘fact’ Crimea was independent of Ukraine?

            Your link does not discuss Crimea and Sevastopol. Congrats. The Treaties I listed accept Ukraine under its U.N. internationally recognized borders.

        • Vladislav Surkov

          Feel free to read the treaties I quoted. Russia has not formally filed an international protest regarding the status of Crimea between 1991-2014.

          Vladimir Putin himself acknowledged the status of Crimea and Sevastopol in 2008.

          • More

            Vladislav Surkov
            “…Russia has not formally filed an international protest regarding the status of Crimea between 1991-2014….”

            The above is correct because the Autonomous Republic of Crimea was made independent of Ukraine in 1991.

            Russia could not file any protest because Crimea became independent as its own legal entity.

            As explained before but again for you to think it over.

            In 1991, the transfer of Crimea to Ukraine that occurred in 1954 was cancelled by the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet of the USSR and Crimea was declared as the independent Autonomous Republic of Crimea.

            Within days of Crimea becoming independent of Ukraine, both the Russian SSR and Ukrainian SSR agreed (unlawfully) for Crimea to become an Autonomous Republic within Ukraine.

            The above unlawful status quo existed from 1991 through to 2014.

            However as the Autonomous Republic of Crimea from 1991 until 2014, the Crimea maintained its own legislature, (RADA, Parliament) and Judicial system (Courts, Law Enforcement) etc. separately and independently of Ukraine.

          • Quartermaster

            It also participated in Ukrainian National elections and was represented in the Ukrainian Parliament. This was the case because it was part of Ukraine.

          • Vladislav Surkov

            That is 100% false. Tatarstan has its own President, Constitution, Legislature, local court system, etc. Is Tatarstan independent off the Russian Federation?

            Crimea’s constitution states Crimea is part of Ukraine. Try reading the document as it existed prior to Russa’s annexation. No amount of revisionist history will change that fact.

          • More

            Vladislav Surkov

            What part do you not understand below:

            Take it up with whichever court that will listen to you then post what happened or write a news article on Euromaidan.

          • Quartermaster

            Why don’t you listen to the facts and just quit posting. You’ve been taken down with every post and stupidly keep trolling. You’ve been caught in lie after lie, piled on top of lies. Even a snail would have understood by now that you aren’t going to get anyone here to swallow the lies you’ve been paid to spread.

          • More

            I’m very happy with the facts I have posted and will keep doing so.

          • Quartermaster

            As I said to your earlier post on “liking your facts” you have yet to post any facts. You live on lies.

          • More

            Vladislav Surkov
            “…Vladimir Putin himself acknowledged the status of Crimea and Sevastopol in 2008….”

            Mr Putin cannot challenge the status of Crimea as it became independent as its own legal entity as well the subordination of the Autonomous Republic of Crimea under Ukraine based on an (unlawful) agreement between the Ukrainian SSR and the Russian SSR.

          • Quartermaster

            He did challenge it. Illegally, I might add. he did by force of arms, then held a bogus referendum under those same guns.

          • Vladislav Surkov

            Do you have a date where the Supreme Soviet of the USSR accepted that referendum?

            By the way, Crimea held another referendum after that. A referendum on the Act of Declaration of Independence was held in Ukraine on December 1, 1991. A majority of 92.3% of voters approved the declaration of independence made by the Verkhovna Rada on August 24, 1991.

            54.19% of Crimeans and 57.07% from Sevastopol approved seceding from the Soviet Union, and remaining with Ukraine.

            The newer referendum negates the previous one. The December 1, 1991 Referendum was not conducted under a military occupation on the streets either.

          • More

            Vladislav Surkov
            “…Do you have a date where the Supreme Soviet of the USSR accepted that referendum?…”

            The date has been posted multiple times.

            Any objection, then take it up with whichever court that will listen to you then write a news article on Euromaidan.

          • Quartermaster

            The objections are yours. No matter what is posted that refutes what you say, you still post your lies.

          • More

            Again:
            If you wish to do so take it to whichever court that will listen to you.

          • Quartermaster

            Again:
            Do it yourself as you’re the one trying to re-write history.

          • Vladislav Surkov

            Post a link. Sorry, your word isn’t good enough for it.

            Inform your employer at 55 Savushkina St., that facts are easily found. Including the Dec. 1, 1991 Referendum where Crimea and Sevastopol chose Ukraine.

      • More

        Vladislav Surkov
        “…It was Ukrainian under the 1991 Belavezha Accords,…”

        The Belavezha Accords is the agreement that declared the Soviet Union effectively dissolved and established the Commonwealth of Independent States (CIS) in its place.

        There is nothing relating to the Autonomous Republic of Crimea belonging to Ukraine in the Belavezha Accords.

        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belavezha_Accords

        However there was a Crimean Sovereignty Referendum was held in 1991, Voters were asked whether they wanted to re-establish the Crimean Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic, which had been abolished in 1954.

        The proposal was approved by 94% of voters.

        Following the referendum, the Supreme Soviet of the Soviet Union passed the law

        “On Restoration of the Crimean Autonomous Soviet Socialistic Republic” on 12 February 1991. By this law it became independent of Ukraine.

        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimean_sovereignty_referendum,_1991

        • slavko

          You are attempting to deceive the readers AGAIN! you wrote: By this law it became independent of Ukraine.
          You changed the wording within the source of the information to accommodate your fantasy. Which makes you even a bigger a$$hole.

          The original reads this way: “By this law it became an autonomous republic within Ukraine.”

          And that is from the link that you posted and then changed the wording of to accommodate your lies: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimean_sovereignty_referendum,_1991

          • More

            slavko
            “…You are attempting to deceive the readers AGAIN! you wrote: By this law it became independent of Ukraine.
            You changed the wording within the source of the information to accommodate your fantasy. Which makes you even a bigger a$$hole….”

            Once again you are a loser because you have to resort to writing abuse.

            The referendum related to Crimea becoming an Autnomous Republic within the USSR not within Ukraine.

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimean_sovereignty_referendum,_1991#Aftermath

            Aftermath:
            Following the referendum, the Supreme Soviet of the Ukrainian SSR passed the law “On Restoration of the Crimean Autonomous Soviet Socialistic Republic” on 12 February 1991. By this law it became independent of Ukraine.

        • Vladislav Surkov

          The Crimean ASSR was a region of the Russian SFSR. It was not a constituent republic of the USSR. The Crimean ASSR was converted into the Crimean Oblast of the RSFSR on June 30, 1945 by the decree of the both Presidiums of the Supreme Soviet of USSR and the Supreme Soviet of RSFSR (published on May 26, 1946), and the Crimean Oblast was transferred to the Ukrainian SSR in 1954.

          I don’t recall the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet of the USSR recognizing Crimea as independent. However Crimeans DID hold a referendum to be part of Ukraine BEFORE the fall of the Soviet Union. A referendum on the Act of Declaration of Independence was held in Ukraine on December 1, 1991. A majority of 92.3% of voters approved the declaration of independence made by the Verkhovna Rada on August 24, 1991.

          54.19% of Crimeans and 57.07% from Sevastopol approved seceding from the Soviet Union, and remaining with Ukraine.

          The Constitution of Crimea itself stated the Peninsula is part of Ukraine.

          • More

            Vladislav Surkov
            “…I don’t recall the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet of the USSR recognizing Crimea as independent. …”

            If you are a honorable person than think again very carefully.

            Though I am British, I have lived in and visited the FSU, Ukraine and Russia many times unlike many of the abusive people who post on this readers forum.

            I know the facts because I have studied Russian, Ukrainian and Soviet history, art, culture, music, people, food, style, military, etc.

            In 1991, the transfer of Crimea to Ukraine that occurred in 1954 was cancelled by the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet of the USSR and Crimea was declared as the independent Autonomous Republic of Crimea.

            Within days of Crimea becoming independent of Ukraine, both the Russian SSR and Ukrainian SSR agreed (unlawfully) for Crimea to become an Autonomous Republic within Ukraine.

            The above unlawful status quo existed from 1991 through to 2014.

            However as the Autonomous Republic of Crimea from 1991 until 2014, the Crimea maintained its own legislature, (RADA, Parliament) and Judicial system (Courts, Law Enforcement) etc. separately and independently of Ukraine.

          • Vladislav Surkov

            The Presidium of the Supreme Soviet of the USSR never cancelled the transfer. Try again comrade.

            By the way, the 1954 Transfer was legal, as the 1936 Soviet Constitution allowed for border redraws with approval from the respective SSRs and the USSR Supreme Soviet. In 1954, Crimea was an oblast, not a SSR or even ‘ASSR’ of the Russian SFSR.

          • More

            Vladislav Surkov
            “…The Presidium of the Supreme Soviet of the USSR never cancelled the transfer. Try again comrade…”

            Rewriting history will not work.

            If you wish to do so take it to whichever court that will listen to you.

          • Quartermaster

            You’re the one trying to re-write history. And, you’re right, it doesn’t work. You’re still being caught out as a liar.

          • More

            If you wish to do so take it to whichever court that will listen to you.

          • Quartermaster

            Why don’t you? You’re the one trying to re-write history. I think you already know, no court will waste their time on your lies.

          • Vladislav Surkov

            I agree. The UN Vote however proves my point. How many countries recognize Crimea as a legal entity of the Russian Federation now? 6? 8 tops?

            The UNGA voted 100-11 that Crimea is Ukraine.

            The UNSC voted 13-1 on the same measure.

            The Presidium of the Supreme Soviet of the USSR.

            Also:

            Following a referendum on 20 January 1991, the Crimean Oblast was upgraded to the status of an Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic on 12 February 1991 by the Supreme Soviet of the Ukrainian SSR. It was not given independence by any Soviet Body. It remained part of Ukraine.

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autonomous_Republic_of_Crimea

            The Presidium of the Supreme Soviet of the Ukrainian SSR is NOT THE SAME as the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet of the USSR.

            The Constitution of Crimea lists it as part of Ukraine. It has EXPLICITLY stated this since 1992.

      • More

        Vladislav Surkov
        “…1994 Budapest Referendum…”

        You may mean the 1994 Budapest Memorandum.

        The Budapest Memorandum does not apply to the 2014 accession of the Autonomous Republic of Crimea as Ukraine cannot force the population of an Autonomous Republic to stay in the Ukraine against its will.

        The principle of self determination of the people of the Republic of Crimea applies:

        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-determination

        The right of nations to self-determination is a cardinal principle in modern international law (commonly regarded as a jus cogens rule), binding, as such, on the United Nations as authoritative interpretation of the Charter’s norms.

        It states that nations, based on respect for the principle of equal rights and fair equality of opportunity, have the right to freely choose their sovereignty and international political status with no interference.

        This principle can be traced to the Atlantic Charter, signed on 14 August 1941, by Franklin D. Roosevelt, President of the United States of America, and Winston Churchill, Prime Minister of the United Kingdom, who pledged The Eight Principal points of the Charter.

        It also is derived from principles espoused by United States President Woodrow Wilson following World War I, after which some new nation states were formed, or previous states were revived after the dissolution of empires.

        • Vladislav Surkov

          Self determination doesn’t apply to Crimea, anymore than it applies to Kosovo. Russians were a majority population, and have not filed human rights violation complaints with any international bodies. Russians also have had the opportunity to vote on the status of Crimea, and chose Ukraine when guns and tanks weren’t on the streets. As late as 2010, Pro-Russian Candidates couldn’t exceed 10% of the Crimean Vote.

          As for self-determination, the only group that would have that entitlement are Crimea’s Tatars. A people that have been discriminated against since Russia conquered the Peninsula in 1783. Under ‘Self Determination’ Laws, only the Tatars would have that right to decide, as they never have been given that chance to choose independence from Russia / USSR.

          Your quotes do not support fact, as even the UN doesn’t support clearly defined rules and conditions for self determination. The U.N. Charter mentioned self-determination only in passing, and the 1948 Universal Declaration of Human Rights not at all.

          • More

            Vladislav Surkov

            We can argue forever regarding the Crimea.

            Ukraine cannot force the majority of the population of an Autonomous Republic to stay in the Ukraine against its will.

            Crimea has now been merged into the Russian Federation as in 2014 the Autonomous Republic of Crimea voted to join the Russian Federation and became the Republic of Crimea

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic_of_Crimea#Declaration_of_Independence_from_Ukraine

          • Quartermaster

            The referendum was bogus because it was held under the guns of an occupying power after thousands were imported and allowing the occupying Army to vote in that referendum. The rest of the world sees Russia for what it is – an occupying power with no legal right to be in Crimea. There is no argument on this. Not even Putin is arguing it anymore.

          • Vladislav Surkov

            You can pretend that Crimea did not vote to remain with Ukraine all you want. A referendum on the Act of Declaration of Independence was held in Ukraine on December 1, 1991. A majority of 92.3% of voters approved the declaration of independence made by the Verkhovna Rada on August 24, 1991.

            54.19% of Crimeans and 57.07% from Sevastopol approved seceding from the Soviet Union, and remaining with Ukraine.

            The fact is, on December 1, 1991, Crimea and Sevastopol chose Ukraine. The USSR no longer exists, and the Russian Federation has no right to weigh in on the matter.

          • More

            Vladislav Surkov
            You can pretend that Crimea did not vote to remain with Ukraine all you want.

            Take it up with whichever court that will listen to you then post what happened.

          • Quartermaster

            Why don’t you? I’m sure almost any court in the free world would laugh out of their courtroom.

          • More

            I am very happy with the outcome regarding Crimea.

            You are the one complaining, repeatedly.

          • Quartermaster

            What facts might those be? All I’ve seen you post is a lot of lies. If those pass as facts in your life, then you live on lies.

    • Quartermaster

      You must like banging your head against a wall because it feels so good when you quit. This bunch is quite well informed on the facts surrounding the events in Ukraine. You may not like it, but there it is.
      Trolls don’t fare at all well here.

      • More

        Quartermaster
        “…You must like banging your head against a wall because it feels so good when you quit….”

        Only people like you are doing what you suggest.

        “… This bunch is quite well informed on the facts surrounding the events in Ukraine….”

        A bunch of over ripe loser Bananas, LoL:)))

        “… You may not like it, but there it is. Trolls don’t fare at all well here….”

        Wrting about yourself, again !

        • Quartermaster

          Hardly, just writing about you and your lies, which you hold so dear.

          • More

            Quartermaster
            “…Hardly, just writing about you and your lies, which you hold so dear….”

            You are very emotional because of your inability to challenge facts.

          • Quartermaster

            You’ve posted no facts to challenge, so “inability” doesn’t even enter into the discussion. But, keep on, keeping on with the lies. Make sure you cash Putin’s check. It won’t be good much longer given Russia’s economic decline.

          • More

            Quartermaster More • 23 minutes ago
            “…You’ve posted no facts to challenge, so “inability” doesn’t even enter into the discussion…”

            Apart from your inability to challenge facts, you are unable to read, so once again:

            Crimea has never lawfully been part of Ukraine, it became a part of the Russian Empire in 1783 and was formally ceded by the Turks to Russia under the Treaty of Jassy.

            In 1921 the Crimean Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic was formed as part of the Russian Soviet Federative Socialist Republic .

            The Crimean ASSR was unlawfully abolished in 1954 and was unlawfully gifted to the Ukrainian SSR by Nikita Khrushchev.

            The Crimean Sovereignty Referendum was held in 1991, Voters were asked whether they wanted to re-establish the Crimean Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic, which had been abolished in 1954.

            The proposal was approved by 94% of voters.

            Following the referendum, the Supreme Soviet of the Soviet Union passed the law

            “On Restoration of the Crimean Autonomous Soviet Socialistic Republic” on 12 February 1991. By this law it became independent of Ukraine.

            The aforementioned territory cannot lawfully be deemed to have been occupied, invaded nor annexed.

            In 2014 The Autonomous Republic of Crimea conducted a referendum, 83 percent of the electorate cast their vote and 96.7 percent of them – Russians, Ukrainians and Tatars – voted to become a Republic in the Russian Federation.

            The vote was observed by 135 representatives of 23 countries and 240 observers represented the Crimean civic society and political parties. They unanimously confirmed that there were no violations and that everyone could vote freely.

          • Quartermaster

            Crimea voted in Ukrainian National Elections and was represented in the Parliament. The facts simply don’t agree with the lies you tell.
            Facts are something you are entirely divorced from.

          • More

            Quartermaster
            “…Crimea voted in Ukrainian National Elections and was represented in the Parliament. …”

            This is the reality now:

            In 2014 the Autonomous Republic of Crimea voted to join the Russian Federation and became the Republic of Crimea

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic_of_Crimea#Declaration_of_Independence_from_Ukraine

          • Quartermaster

            This is reality: Russia is an occupying power that held an illegal referendum, importing thousands and allowing the occupying Army to vote so as to overwhelm the native population that owned the land.
            The reality is Russians are thieves.

          • More

            Quartermaster
            An old English saying, feel free to think and say what you like.

          • Quartermaster

            You obviously are not English. You’re the one posting lies, not me. I live with the facts and the facts are that Crimea was part of Ukraine, it was represented in the Ukrainian Parliament and voted in Ukrainian National Elections. Those are the facts. No one needs to “believe” the facts.

  • More

    The Republic of Crimea in the Russian Federation is a success story unlike the losers who have taken control in Kiev.

    Crimeans are very glad to be rid of Kiev government which invested about US$120 million per year in the Crimean economy.

    Russia is spending many US$ Billions in Crimea with increased Pensions, Salaries and Social Services as well as developing its:

    Healthcare
    Education
    Housing
    Infrastructure
    Industry
    Business and Commerce
    Military

  • Vol Ya

    Putin thought he would invade Ukraine and people would welcome him with open arms. He was wrong again about Ukraine. When will Putin understand that Ukraine is not russia and that the people of Ukraine do not want to live under Russia’s command and do not want Putin as their leader.

    • Quartermaster

      The only way he has held onto Crimea is by turning the place into a prison camp.

      • More

        Quartermaster
        “…The only way he has held onto Crimea is by turning the place into a prison camp….”

        You are writing fantasy.

        Tourism:
        The Ministry of Tourism of Crimea expects 6 million visitors overall in 2016, while last year (2015) the inflow was 4.6 million.

        In the first nine months of 2016, about 4.9 million travelers visited Crimea. This is 24.2% more compared to the same period in 2015

        Tourism Review is an international tourism website:
        http://www.tourism-review.com/tourists-in-crimea-come-in-greater-numbers-news5148#e4EHrFl2FGLVS6We.99

        Four Crimean Cities Make Top 10 List for Family Summer Vacations
        http://www.tourism-review.com/crimean-cities-rated-among-the-best-family-destinations-news4595

        Crimea Plans to Make US$2 Billion on Summer Tourism This Year
        http://www.tourism-review.com/crimea-estimates-usd2-billion-from-summer-tourism-this-year-news4498

        • Quartermaster

          All far lower than it was before Putin invaded. You really need to get out more and see what’s really out here in the world. Your lies are going no where.

          • More

            Quartermaster
            “…All far lower than it was before Putin invaded…”
            “…You really need to get out more and see what’s really out here in the world. Your lies are going no where….”

            You are far too emotional because you cannot challenge facts.

            The highest annual average of tourism in Crimea was 2.7 million prior to Crimea joining the Russian Federation, (2014 and earlier).

            Previously 70% of the tourists visiting Crimea were from Ukraine on limited and low budgets and they contributed 50% of the tourism revenue.

            Now tourists predominantly come from Russia and have a much higher budget and spend considerably more.

            Crimea Tourist Numbers:
            2016 – 6 Million
            2015 – 4.6 Million

          • Quartermaster

            There is nothing to challenge. Your figures are simply lies. The truth is far different. Crimea is simply a prison camp that is mostly cut off from the world other than the Russian Military occupation.

          • More

            Quartermaster
            “…Your figures are simply lies…..”

            You are incapable of challenging facts, however if you wish to do so then contact:

            Tourism Review is an international tourism website:
            http://www.tourism-review.com/tourists-in-crimea-come-in-greater-numbers-news5148#e4EHrFl2FGLVS6We.99

            Four Crimean Cities Make Top 10 List for Family Summer Vacations
            http://www.tourism-review.com/crimean-cities-rated-among-the-best-family-destinations-news4595

            Crimea Plans to Make US$2 Billion on Summer Tourism This Year
            http://www.tourism-review.com/crimea-estimates-usd2-billion-from-summer-tourism-this-year-news4498

        • Dagwood Bumstead

          Real-time videos of Crimean beaches and resorts prove the very opposite of what you claim………

          • More

            Dagwood Bumstead
            “…Real-time videos of Crimean beaches and resorts prove the very opposite of what you claim………”

            You can contact the:
            Tourism Review an international tourism website:
            http://www.tourism-review.com/tourists-in-crimea-come-in-greater-numbers-news5148#e4EHrFl2FGLVS6We.99

          • Quartermaster

            The Russian educational system in in bigger trouble than I thought. You have no idea what “real-time” means.

          • More

            Quartermaster
            “…The Russian educational system in in bigger trouble than I thought…”

            The only thing in trouble is your brain as you are writing about Russian education when this news article is about Crimea.

            Regarding education in Russia:
            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Education_in_Russia

            Highlights:
            Education in Russia is free and provided predominantly by the state.

            The literacy rate in Russia, according to a 2015 estimate by the Central Intelligence Agency, is 99.7% (99.7% men, 99.6% women).

            In 2014, Russia was the 6th most popular destination for international students.

            In 2014, the Pearson/Economist Intelligence Unit rated Russia’s education as 8th best in Europe.

            In 2016 the US company Bloomberg rated Russia’s higher education as the third best in the world.

          • Quartermaster

            Your the one that doesn’t understand the concept “real time.” I’ve talked with many grad students from Russia. They worked hard to get to the US because of the collapse of the Russian system. Your own people have told the truth on your lies.

          • More

            Quartermaster
            You can talk to whoever, it will not change anything.

          • Quartermaster

            Of course. The truth doesn’t change, and they told the truth.

          • More

            Quartermaster
            “…Of course. The truth doesn’t change, and they told the truth….”

            It is time for you to realise that facts quoted to you are from an independent website.

            However you try to attack the messenger at all angles when you should be producing proof that it is not so.

            Your watching real time video of Crimean resorts, etc., is not proof of anything.

          • Quartermaster

            It proves far more than you like my lying friend. You aren’t a messenger. You’re a liar. The two are far different.

  • More

    As the Republic of Crimea in the Russian Federation, Crimea has become a success story.

    Tourism:
    The Ministry of Tourism of Crimea expects 6 million visitors overall in 2016, while last year (2015) the inflow was 4.6 million.

    In the first nine months of 2016, about 4.9 million travelers visited Crimea. This is 24.2% more compared to the same period in 2015

    Tourism Review is an international tourism website:
    http://www.tourism-review.com/tourists-in-crimea-come-in-greater-numbers-news5148#e4EHrFl2FGLVS6We.99

    Four Crimean Cities Make Top 10 List for Family Summer Vacations
    http://www.tourism-review.com/crimean-cities-rated-among-the-best-family-destinations-news4595

    Crimea Plans to Make US$2 Billion on Summer Tourism This Year
    http://www.tourism-review.com/crimea-estimates-usd2-billion-from-summer-tourism-this-year-news4498

    • Quartermaster

      Your lies are already known for what they are. Lies.

      • More

        Quartermaster
        “…Your lies are already known for what they are. Lies…”

        You are incapable of challenging the Republic of Crimea has become a success in the Russian Federation.

        Tourism:
        The Ministry of Tourism of Crimea expects 6 million visitors overall in 2016, while last year (2015) the inflow was 4.6 million.

        In the first nine months of 2016, about 4.9 million travelers visited Crimea. This is 24.2% more compared to the same period in 2015

        Tourism Review is an international tourism website:
        http://www.tourism-review.com/tourists-in-crimea-come-in-greater-numbers-news5148#e4EHrFl2FGLVS6We.99

        Four Crimean Cities Make Top 10 List for Family Summer Vacations
        http://www.tourism-review.com/crimean-cities-rated-among-the-best-family-destinations-news4595

        Crimea Plans to Make US$2 Billion on Summer Tourism This Year
        http://www.tourism-review.com/crimea-estimates-usd2-billion-from-summer-tourism-this-year-news4498

        • Quartermaster

          And the real time cameras show you are liar. As I said above, things are better in comparison to the summer of 2014, but that’s a pretty low bar and they have never reached the same level they were at before Putin stole the land.

          • More

            Quartermaster

            You will need to produce all the video recordings for 2015 and 2016 you refer to until then you are living in fantasy.

          • Quartermaster

            Standard deflection for people of your ilk. Go look yourself. I already know what they look like. I also am aware of the economic statistics on Crimea. They aren’t good.
            Frankly, you already know the truth and that what you post here are simply brazen lies.